Does anyone happen to have a copy of:
Floyd, Michael. A Conversation with Charles F. Goldfarb. Web Techniques (Vol.3, Issue 11), pp.38–41, November, 1998
It used to be online, but has now disappeared, and the Internet Archive doesn’t have it either. I’d like to check a quote that I copied back then.
Markup Languages, by @j9t [@frontenddogma.com]:
Well, “Episode 21: Keynote — John McCarthy” actually has a recording and he gives that quote at timestamp 1:13:15:
http://www.oopsla.org/oopsla2007/index56d8.html
http://www.oopsla.org/podcasts/Keynote_JohnMcCarthy.mp3
“When W3C decided not to use #LISP format but to imitate #SGML for that [it] showed a certain capacity to make mistakes” *laughter* “which they probably hadn't lost”
Conclusion: the first part is similar, but the second part of the original quote is unfamiliar.
Isn't the WWW a wonderful to be able to research this? #markupLanguages
The statement “`<input checkbox>` is per SGML rules equivalent to `<input type="checkbox">`, but HTML parsers treat it as `<input checkbox="">`” is…
fwiw, I used #DocBook #SGML in #Emacs to generate LaTeX/LilyPond, even when Macmillan demanded I submit MSWord¹ docs, I'd just emit them as an output! Mind you, that was last century, but I'd still do it that way today, if I had to.
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¹ I call those apps "font painters', or WYSIAYG (what you see is ALL you get
As I possibly need to do soon something with #DITA.
DITA which is based on XML with some DTD is as like as HTML derived from SGML. In fact HTML is a simplified SGML.
I was aware that #SGML was developed at Boing. They invented it for Airplane documentation.
Today I learned that SGML is based on GML: "General Markup Language" from IBM.
But maybe simply "Golfarb, Mosher, Lorie": the #IBM engineers back in the 1960s.
What’s especially interesting is that Don Chamberlin isn’t just some random IBMer (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Donald_D._Chamberlin). And he wasn’t only involved with Quill SGML editor, but also with the Quilt XML query language, which heavily influenced XQuery (he was one of the editors of the W3C XQuery 1.0 recommendation).
In my talk for the 2019 #XMLPrague paper “History and the Future of Markup” http://archive.xmlprague.cz/2019/files/xmlprague-2019-proceedings.pdf#page=335 I speculated about the use of #REXX as a language for #SGML tree manipulation.
Last night I “discovered” that REXX had indeed been used for this at IBM, and Goldfarb knew about it: namely in the experimental Quill editor running on an experimental windowing system on an experimental operating system on the IBM RT PC… (see, e.g., https://doi.org/10.1145/62506.62524)
@mjgardner I know man. I was there. Am there. You just gotta roll with the punches. And #XML was a reaction to #SGML for the web, so it all goes around and around.
